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What happens if I start too many background jobs?


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.everyoneloves__top-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__mid-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__bot-mid-leaderboard:empty{ margin-bottom:0;
}







3















I need to do some work on 700 network devices using an expect script. I can get it done sequentially, but so far the runtime is around 24 hours. This is mostly due to the time it takes to establish a connection and the delay in the output from these devices (old ones). I'm able to establish two connections and have them run in parallel just fine, but how far can I push that?



I don't imagine I could do all 700 of them at once, surely there's some limit to the no. of telnet connections my VM can manage.



If I did try to start 700 of them in some sort of loop like this:



for node in `ls ~/sagLogs/`; do  
foo &
done


With




  • CPU 12 CPUs x Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5649 @ 2.53GHz


  • Memory 47.94 GB



My question is:




  1. Could all 700 instances possibly run concurrently?

  2. How far could I get until my server reaches its limit?

  3. When that limit is reached, will it just wait to begin the next iteration off foo or will the box crash?


I'm running in a corporate production environment unfortunately, so I can't exactly just try and see what happens.










share|improve this question























  • I’m guessing each job uses very little CPU and RAM, is that right?

    – Stephen Kitt
    3 hours ago











  • Honestly I have a hard time telling. Htop isn't very helpful - when I'm running one instance the CPU reads: CPU: 86.9% sys: 13.1% low: 0.0% and RAM reads Mem:3.86G used:178M buffers:2.28G cache:608M Any guess?

    – KuboMD
    3 hours ago


















3















I need to do some work on 700 network devices using an expect script. I can get it done sequentially, but so far the runtime is around 24 hours. This is mostly due to the time it takes to establish a connection and the delay in the output from these devices (old ones). I'm able to establish two connections and have them run in parallel just fine, but how far can I push that?



I don't imagine I could do all 700 of them at once, surely there's some limit to the no. of telnet connections my VM can manage.



If I did try to start 700 of them in some sort of loop like this:



for node in `ls ~/sagLogs/`; do  
foo &
done


With




  • CPU 12 CPUs x Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5649 @ 2.53GHz


  • Memory 47.94 GB



My question is:




  1. Could all 700 instances possibly run concurrently?

  2. How far could I get until my server reaches its limit?

  3. When that limit is reached, will it just wait to begin the next iteration off foo or will the box crash?


I'm running in a corporate production environment unfortunately, so I can't exactly just try and see what happens.










share|improve this question























  • I’m guessing each job uses very little CPU and RAM, is that right?

    – Stephen Kitt
    3 hours ago











  • Honestly I have a hard time telling. Htop isn't very helpful - when I'm running one instance the CPU reads: CPU: 86.9% sys: 13.1% low: 0.0% and RAM reads Mem:3.86G used:178M buffers:2.28G cache:608M Any guess?

    – KuboMD
    3 hours ago














3












3








3








I need to do some work on 700 network devices using an expect script. I can get it done sequentially, but so far the runtime is around 24 hours. This is mostly due to the time it takes to establish a connection and the delay in the output from these devices (old ones). I'm able to establish two connections and have them run in parallel just fine, but how far can I push that?



I don't imagine I could do all 700 of them at once, surely there's some limit to the no. of telnet connections my VM can manage.



If I did try to start 700 of them in some sort of loop like this:



for node in `ls ~/sagLogs/`; do  
foo &
done


With




  • CPU 12 CPUs x Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5649 @ 2.53GHz


  • Memory 47.94 GB



My question is:




  1. Could all 700 instances possibly run concurrently?

  2. How far could I get until my server reaches its limit?

  3. When that limit is reached, will it just wait to begin the next iteration off foo or will the box crash?


I'm running in a corporate production environment unfortunately, so I can't exactly just try and see what happens.










share|improve this question














I need to do some work on 700 network devices using an expect script. I can get it done sequentially, but so far the runtime is around 24 hours. This is mostly due to the time it takes to establish a connection and the delay in the output from these devices (old ones). I'm able to establish two connections and have them run in parallel just fine, but how far can I push that?



I don't imagine I could do all 700 of them at once, surely there's some limit to the no. of telnet connections my VM can manage.



If I did try to start 700 of them in some sort of loop like this:



for node in `ls ~/sagLogs/`; do  
foo &
done


With




  • CPU 12 CPUs x Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5649 @ 2.53GHz


  • Memory 47.94 GB



My question is:




  1. Could all 700 instances possibly run concurrently?

  2. How far could I get until my server reaches its limit?

  3. When that limit is reached, will it just wait to begin the next iteration off foo or will the box crash?


I'm running in a corporate production environment unfortunately, so I can't exactly just try and see what happens.







bash background-process expect telnet jobs






share|improve this question













share|improve this question











share|improve this question




share|improve this question










asked 3 hours ago









KuboMDKuboMD

1888




1888













  • I’m guessing each job uses very little CPU and RAM, is that right?

    – Stephen Kitt
    3 hours ago











  • Honestly I have a hard time telling. Htop isn't very helpful - when I'm running one instance the CPU reads: CPU: 86.9% sys: 13.1% low: 0.0% and RAM reads Mem:3.86G used:178M buffers:2.28G cache:608M Any guess?

    – KuboMD
    3 hours ago



















  • I’m guessing each job uses very little CPU and RAM, is that right?

    – Stephen Kitt
    3 hours ago











  • Honestly I have a hard time telling. Htop isn't very helpful - when I'm running one instance the CPU reads: CPU: 86.9% sys: 13.1% low: 0.0% and RAM reads Mem:3.86G used:178M buffers:2.28G cache:608M Any guess?

    – KuboMD
    3 hours ago

















I’m guessing each job uses very little CPU and RAM, is that right?

– Stephen Kitt
3 hours ago





I’m guessing each job uses very little CPU and RAM, is that right?

– Stephen Kitt
3 hours ago













Honestly I have a hard time telling. Htop isn't very helpful - when I'm running one instance the CPU reads: CPU: 86.9% sys: 13.1% low: 0.0% and RAM reads Mem:3.86G used:178M buffers:2.28G cache:608M Any guess?

– KuboMD
3 hours ago





Honestly I have a hard time telling. Htop isn't very helpful - when I'm running one instance the CPU reads: CPU: 86.9% sys: 13.1% low: 0.0% and RAM reads Mem:3.86G used:178M buffers:2.28G cache:608M Any guess?

– KuboMD
3 hours ago










2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes


















2















Could all 700 instances possibly run concurrently?




That depends on what you mean by concurrently. If we're being picky, then no, they can't unless you have 700 threads of execution on your system you can utilize (so probably not). Realistically though, yes, they probably can, provided you have enough RAM and/or swap space on the system. UNIX and it's various children are remarkably good at managing huge levels of concurrency, that's part of why they're so popular for large-scale HPC usage.




How far could I get until my server reaches its limit?




This is impossible to answer concretely without a whole lot more info. Pretty much, you need to have enough memory to meet:




  • The entire run-time memory requirements of one job, times 700.

  • The memory requirements of bash to manage that many jobs (bash is not horrible about this, but the job control isn't exactly memory efficient).

  • Any other memory requirements on the system.


Assuming you meet that (again, with only 50GB of RAM, you still ahve to deal with other issues:




  • How much CPU time is going to be wasted by bash on job control? Probably not much, but with hundreds of jobs, it could be significant.

  • How much network bandwidth is this going to need? Just opening all those connections may swamp your network for a couple of minutes depending on your bandwidth and latency.

  • Many other things I probably haven't thought of.



When that limit is reached, will it just wait to begin the next iteration off foo or will the box crash?




It depends on what limit is hit. If it's memory, something will die on the system (more specifically, get killed by the kernel in an attempt to free up memory) or the system itself may crash (it's not unusual to configure systems to intentionally crash when running out of memory). If it's CPU time, it will just keep going without issue, it'll just be impossible to do much else on the system. If it's the network though, you might crash other systems or services.





What you really need here is not to run all the jobs at the same time. Instead, split them into batches, and run all the jobs within a batch at the same time, let them finish, then start the next batch. GUN Parallel can be used for this, but it's less than ideal at that scale in a production environment (if you go with it, don't get too aggressive, like I said, you might swamp the network and affect systems you otherwise would not be touching). I would really recommend looking into a proper network orchestration tool like Ansible (https://www.ansible.com/), as that will not only solve your concurrency issues (Ansible does batching like I mentioned above automatically), but also give you a lot of other useful features to work with (like idempotent execution of tasks, nice status reports, and native integration with a very large number of other tools).






share|improve this answer































    5














    It's hard to say specifically how many instances could be run as background jobs in the manner you describe. But a normal server can certainly maintain 700 concurrent connections as long as you do it correctly. Webservers do this all the time.



    May I suggest that you use GNU parallel (https://www.gnu.org/software/parallel/) or something similar to accomplish this? It would give you a number of advantages to the background job approach:




    • You can easily change the number of concurrent sessions.

    • And it will wait until sessions complete before it starts new ones.

    • It it easier to abort.


    Have a look here for a quick start: https://www.gnu.org/software/parallel/parallel_tutorial.html#A-single-input-source






    share|improve this answer








    New contributor




    laenkeio is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.
















    • 1





      Interesting! I'll take a look at this. Do you know if attempting this kind of operation (without the help of Parallel) would risk crashing the hypervisor?

      – KuboMD
      2 hours ago












    Your Answer








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    2 Answers
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    active

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    2 Answers
    2






    active

    oldest

    votes









    active

    oldest

    votes






    active

    oldest

    votes









    2















    Could all 700 instances possibly run concurrently?




    That depends on what you mean by concurrently. If we're being picky, then no, they can't unless you have 700 threads of execution on your system you can utilize (so probably not). Realistically though, yes, they probably can, provided you have enough RAM and/or swap space on the system. UNIX and it's various children are remarkably good at managing huge levels of concurrency, that's part of why they're so popular for large-scale HPC usage.




    How far could I get until my server reaches its limit?




    This is impossible to answer concretely without a whole lot more info. Pretty much, you need to have enough memory to meet:




    • The entire run-time memory requirements of one job, times 700.

    • The memory requirements of bash to manage that many jobs (bash is not horrible about this, but the job control isn't exactly memory efficient).

    • Any other memory requirements on the system.


    Assuming you meet that (again, with only 50GB of RAM, you still ahve to deal with other issues:




    • How much CPU time is going to be wasted by bash on job control? Probably not much, but with hundreds of jobs, it could be significant.

    • How much network bandwidth is this going to need? Just opening all those connections may swamp your network for a couple of minutes depending on your bandwidth and latency.

    • Many other things I probably haven't thought of.



    When that limit is reached, will it just wait to begin the next iteration off foo or will the box crash?




    It depends on what limit is hit. If it's memory, something will die on the system (more specifically, get killed by the kernel in an attempt to free up memory) or the system itself may crash (it's not unusual to configure systems to intentionally crash when running out of memory). If it's CPU time, it will just keep going without issue, it'll just be impossible to do much else on the system. If it's the network though, you might crash other systems or services.





    What you really need here is not to run all the jobs at the same time. Instead, split them into batches, and run all the jobs within a batch at the same time, let them finish, then start the next batch. GUN Parallel can be used for this, but it's less than ideal at that scale in a production environment (if you go with it, don't get too aggressive, like I said, you might swamp the network and affect systems you otherwise would not be touching). I would really recommend looking into a proper network orchestration tool like Ansible (https://www.ansible.com/), as that will not only solve your concurrency issues (Ansible does batching like I mentioned above automatically), but also give you a lot of other useful features to work with (like idempotent execution of tasks, nice status reports, and native integration with a very large number of other tools).






    share|improve this answer




























      2















      Could all 700 instances possibly run concurrently?




      That depends on what you mean by concurrently. If we're being picky, then no, they can't unless you have 700 threads of execution on your system you can utilize (so probably not). Realistically though, yes, they probably can, provided you have enough RAM and/or swap space on the system. UNIX and it's various children are remarkably good at managing huge levels of concurrency, that's part of why they're so popular for large-scale HPC usage.




      How far could I get until my server reaches its limit?




      This is impossible to answer concretely without a whole lot more info. Pretty much, you need to have enough memory to meet:




      • The entire run-time memory requirements of one job, times 700.

      • The memory requirements of bash to manage that many jobs (bash is not horrible about this, but the job control isn't exactly memory efficient).

      • Any other memory requirements on the system.


      Assuming you meet that (again, with only 50GB of RAM, you still ahve to deal with other issues:




      • How much CPU time is going to be wasted by bash on job control? Probably not much, but with hundreds of jobs, it could be significant.

      • How much network bandwidth is this going to need? Just opening all those connections may swamp your network for a couple of minutes depending on your bandwidth and latency.

      • Many other things I probably haven't thought of.



      When that limit is reached, will it just wait to begin the next iteration off foo or will the box crash?




      It depends on what limit is hit. If it's memory, something will die on the system (more specifically, get killed by the kernel in an attempt to free up memory) or the system itself may crash (it's not unusual to configure systems to intentionally crash when running out of memory). If it's CPU time, it will just keep going without issue, it'll just be impossible to do much else on the system. If it's the network though, you might crash other systems or services.





      What you really need here is not to run all the jobs at the same time. Instead, split them into batches, and run all the jobs within a batch at the same time, let them finish, then start the next batch. GUN Parallel can be used for this, but it's less than ideal at that scale in a production environment (if you go with it, don't get too aggressive, like I said, you might swamp the network and affect systems you otherwise would not be touching). I would really recommend looking into a proper network orchestration tool like Ansible (https://www.ansible.com/), as that will not only solve your concurrency issues (Ansible does batching like I mentioned above automatically), but also give you a lot of other useful features to work with (like idempotent execution of tasks, nice status reports, and native integration with a very large number of other tools).






      share|improve this answer


























        2












        2








        2








        Could all 700 instances possibly run concurrently?




        That depends on what you mean by concurrently. If we're being picky, then no, they can't unless you have 700 threads of execution on your system you can utilize (so probably not). Realistically though, yes, they probably can, provided you have enough RAM and/or swap space on the system. UNIX and it's various children are remarkably good at managing huge levels of concurrency, that's part of why they're so popular for large-scale HPC usage.




        How far could I get until my server reaches its limit?




        This is impossible to answer concretely without a whole lot more info. Pretty much, you need to have enough memory to meet:




        • The entire run-time memory requirements of one job, times 700.

        • The memory requirements of bash to manage that many jobs (bash is not horrible about this, but the job control isn't exactly memory efficient).

        • Any other memory requirements on the system.


        Assuming you meet that (again, with only 50GB of RAM, you still ahve to deal with other issues:




        • How much CPU time is going to be wasted by bash on job control? Probably not much, but with hundreds of jobs, it could be significant.

        • How much network bandwidth is this going to need? Just opening all those connections may swamp your network for a couple of minutes depending on your bandwidth and latency.

        • Many other things I probably haven't thought of.



        When that limit is reached, will it just wait to begin the next iteration off foo or will the box crash?




        It depends on what limit is hit. If it's memory, something will die on the system (more specifically, get killed by the kernel in an attempt to free up memory) or the system itself may crash (it's not unusual to configure systems to intentionally crash when running out of memory). If it's CPU time, it will just keep going without issue, it'll just be impossible to do much else on the system. If it's the network though, you might crash other systems or services.





        What you really need here is not to run all the jobs at the same time. Instead, split them into batches, and run all the jobs within a batch at the same time, let them finish, then start the next batch. GUN Parallel can be used for this, but it's less than ideal at that scale in a production environment (if you go with it, don't get too aggressive, like I said, you might swamp the network and affect systems you otherwise would not be touching). I would really recommend looking into a proper network orchestration tool like Ansible (https://www.ansible.com/), as that will not only solve your concurrency issues (Ansible does batching like I mentioned above automatically), but also give you a lot of other useful features to work with (like idempotent execution of tasks, nice status reports, and native integration with a very large number of other tools).






        share|improve this answer














        Could all 700 instances possibly run concurrently?




        That depends on what you mean by concurrently. If we're being picky, then no, they can't unless you have 700 threads of execution on your system you can utilize (so probably not). Realistically though, yes, they probably can, provided you have enough RAM and/or swap space on the system. UNIX and it's various children are remarkably good at managing huge levels of concurrency, that's part of why they're so popular for large-scale HPC usage.




        How far could I get until my server reaches its limit?




        This is impossible to answer concretely without a whole lot more info. Pretty much, you need to have enough memory to meet:




        • The entire run-time memory requirements of one job, times 700.

        • The memory requirements of bash to manage that many jobs (bash is not horrible about this, but the job control isn't exactly memory efficient).

        • Any other memory requirements on the system.


        Assuming you meet that (again, with only 50GB of RAM, you still ahve to deal with other issues:




        • How much CPU time is going to be wasted by bash on job control? Probably not much, but with hundreds of jobs, it could be significant.

        • How much network bandwidth is this going to need? Just opening all those connections may swamp your network for a couple of minutes depending on your bandwidth and latency.

        • Many other things I probably haven't thought of.



        When that limit is reached, will it just wait to begin the next iteration off foo or will the box crash?




        It depends on what limit is hit. If it's memory, something will die on the system (more specifically, get killed by the kernel in an attempt to free up memory) or the system itself may crash (it's not unusual to configure systems to intentionally crash when running out of memory). If it's CPU time, it will just keep going without issue, it'll just be impossible to do much else on the system. If it's the network though, you might crash other systems or services.





        What you really need here is not to run all the jobs at the same time. Instead, split them into batches, and run all the jobs within a batch at the same time, let them finish, then start the next batch. GUN Parallel can be used for this, but it's less than ideal at that scale in a production environment (if you go with it, don't get too aggressive, like I said, you might swamp the network and affect systems you otherwise would not be touching). I would really recommend looking into a proper network orchestration tool like Ansible (https://www.ansible.com/), as that will not only solve your concurrency issues (Ansible does batching like I mentioned above automatically), but also give you a lot of other useful features to work with (like idempotent execution of tasks, nice status reports, and native integration with a very large number of other tools).







        share|improve this answer












        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer










        answered 58 mins ago









        Austin HemmelgarnAustin Hemmelgarn

        6,32111119




        6,32111119

























            5














            It's hard to say specifically how many instances could be run as background jobs in the manner you describe. But a normal server can certainly maintain 700 concurrent connections as long as you do it correctly. Webservers do this all the time.



            May I suggest that you use GNU parallel (https://www.gnu.org/software/parallel/) or something similar to accomplish this? It would give you a number of advantages to the background job approach:




            • You can easily change the number of concurrent sessions.

            • And it will wait until sessions complete before it starts new ones.

            • It it easier to abort.


            Have a look here for a quick start: https://www.gnu.org/software/parallel/parallel_tutorial.html#A-single-input-source






            share|improve this answer








            New contributor




            laenkeio is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.
















            • 1





              Interesting! I'll take a look at this. Do you know if attempting this kind of operation (without the help of Parallel) would risk crashing the hypervisor?

              – KuboMD
              2 hours ago
















            5














            It's hard to say specifically how many instances could be run as background jobs in the manner you describe. But a normal server can certainly maintain 700 concurrent connections as long as you do it correctly. Webservers do this all the time.



            May I suggest that you use GNU parallel (https://www.gnu.org/software/parallel/) or something similar to accomplish this? It would give you a number of advantages to the background job approach:




            • You can easily change the number of concurrent sessions.

            • And it will wait until sessions complete before it starts new ones.

            • It it easier to abort.


            Have a look here for a quick start: https://www.gnu.org/software/parallel/parallel_tutorial.html#A-single-input-source






            share|improve this answer








            New contributor




            laenkeio is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.
















            • 1





              Interesting! I'll take a look at this. Do you know if attempting this kind of operation (without the help of Parallel) would risk crashing the hypervisor?

              – KuboMD
              2 hours ago














            5












            5








            5







            It's hard to say specifically how many instances could be run as background jobs in the manner you describe. But a normal server can certainly maintain 700 concurrent connections as long as you do it correctly. Webservers do this all the time.



            May I suggest that you use GNU parallel (https://www.gnu.org/software/parallel/) or something similar to accomplish this? It would give you a number of advantages to the background job approach:




            • You can easily change the number of concurrent sessions.

            • And it will wait until sessions complete before it starts new ones.

            • It it easier to abort.


            Have a look here for a quick start: https://www.gnu.org/software/parallel/parallel_tutorial.html#A-single-input-source






            share|improve this answer








            New contributor




            laenkeio is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.










            It's hard to say specifically how many instances could be run as background jobs in the manner you describe. But a normal server can certainly maintain 700 concurrent connections as long as you do it correctly. Webservers do this all the time.



            May I suggest that you use GNU parallel (https://www.gnu.org/software/parallel/) or something similar to accomplish this? It would give you a number of advantages to the background job approach:




            • You can easily change the number of concurrent sessions.

            • And it will wait until sessions complete before it starts new ones.

            • It it easier to abort.


            Have a look here for a quick start: https://www.gnu.org/software/parallel/parallel_tutorial.html#A-single-input-source







            share|improve this answer








            New contributor




            laenkeio is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.









            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer






            New contributor




            laenkeio is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.









            answered 2 hours ago









            laenkeiolaenkeio

            1065




            1065




            New contributor




            laenkeio is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.





            New contributor





            laenkeio is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.






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            • 1





              Interesting! I'll take a look at this. Do you know if attempting this kind of operation (without the help of Parallel) would risk crashing the hypervisor?

              – KuboMD
              2 hours ago














            • 1





              Interesting! I'll take a look at this. Do you know if attempting this kind of operation (without the help of Parallel) would risk crashing the hypervisor?

              – KuboMD
              2 hours ago








            1




            1





            Interesting! I'll take a look at this. Do you know if attempting this kind of operation (without the help of Parallel) would risk crashing the hypervisor?

            – KuboMD
            2 hours ago





            Interesting! I'll take a look at this. Do you know if attempting this kind of operation (without the help of Parallel) would risk crashing the hypervisor?

            – KuboMD
            2 hours ago


















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