Is there an Avengers Illuminati reference in Age of Ultron?Would there be alien involvement in Avengers: Age...
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Is there an Avengers Illuminati reference in Age of Ultron?
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I was watching Avengers: Age of Ultron (2015), and saw this sticker in one of the scenes in Sokovia (in particular when Quicksilver is listening to Captain America's speech, right before a piece of paper covers it):

It looks like it could be related to Avengers Illuminati (triangle with eye inside, and the colors of the members), but I could not find anything about it (in the comics or online).
Is that a reference to any other Marvel movies/universe? And if it is, should I have read/watch something first to get it?
marvel marvel-cinematic-universe avengers-age-of-ultron object-identification marvel-illuminati
|
show 1 more comment
I was watching Avengers: Age of Ultron (2015), and saw this sticker in one of the scenes in Sokovia (in particular when Quicksilver is listening to Captain America's speech, right before a piece of paper covers it):

It looks like it could be related to Avengers Illuminati (triangle with eye inside, and the colors of the members), but I could not find anything about it (in the comics or online).
Is that a reference to any other Marvel movies/universe? And if it is, should I have read/watch something first to get it?
marvel marvel-cinematic-universe avengers-age-of-ultron object-identification marvel-illuminati
I know this question is a bit of a stretch of what's on-topic and not, any suggestion for improving it will be welcomed.
– Alvaro Montoro
May 22 '18 at 15:08
3
Welcome to SFF! This seems perfectly on topic to me, nice spot!
– TheLethalCarrot
May 22 '18 at 15:10
3
Only suggestion I might add is to maybe include an image of the Avengers Illuminati symbol you're referencing for comparison.
– Mwr247
May 22 '18 at 16:33
possibly....cinemablend.com/news/1575759/…
– NKCampbell
May 22 '18 at 17:25
I don’t know if the Avengers Illuminati have a symbol. There’s the avengers sign inside an omega, but there’s no reference to it in the comic books I’ve read (Road to Civil War and New Avengers Illuminati). What I meant is that the Eye of Providence (a triangle with an eye inside) is a traditional Illuminati symbol, and this one seems to be subdivided in triangles of colors that match some of the members of that group (for example, the blue part with a white circle and a number inside that identifies Reed Richards, or the gold and red from Ironman). I may be just reading too much into it.
– Alvaro Montoro
May 22 '18 at 21:24
|
show 1 more comment
I was watching Avengers: Age of Ultron (2015), and saw this sticker in one of the scenes in Sokovia (in particular when Quicksilver is listening to Captain America's speech, right before a piece of paper covers it):

It looks like it could be related to Avengers Illuminati (triangle with eye inside, and the colors of the members), but I could not find anything about it (in the comics or online).
Is that a reference to any other Marvel movies/universe? And if it is, should I have read/watch something first to get it?
marvel marvel-cinematic-universe avengers-age-of-ultron object-identification marvel-illuminati
I was watching Avengers: Age of Ultron (2015), and saw this sticker in one of the scenes in Sokovia (in particular when Quicksilver is listening to Captain America's speech, right before a piece of paper covers it):

It looks like it could be related to Avengers Illuminati (triangle with eye inside, and the colors of the members), but I could not find anything about it (in the comics or online).
Is that a reference to any other Marvel movies/universe? And if it is, should I have read/watch something first to get it?
marvel marvel-cinematic-universe avengers-age-of-ultron object-identification marvel-illuminati
marvel marvel-cinematic-universe avengers-age-of-ultron object-identification marvel-illuminati
edited May 23 '18 at 7:36
Edlothiad
54.5k21287297
54.5k21287297
asked May 22 '18 at 15:05
Alvaro MontoroAlvaro Montoro
1565
1565
I know this question is a bit of a stretch of what's on-topic and not, any suggestion for improving it will be welcomed.
– Alvaro Montoro
May 22 '18 at 15:08
3
Welcome to SFF! This seems perfectly on topic to me, nice spot!
– TheLethalCarrot
May 22 '18 at 15:10
3
Only suggestion I might add is to maybe include an image of the Avengers Illuminati symbol you're referencing for comparison.
– Mwr247
May 22 '18 at 16:33
possibly....cinemablend.com/news/1575759/…
– NKCampbell
May 22 '18 at 17:25
I don’t know if the Avengers Illuminati have a symbol. There’s the avengers sign inside an omega, but there’s no reference to it in the comic books I’ve read (Road to Civil War and New Avengers Illuminati). What I meant is that the Eye of Providence (a triangle with an eye inside) is a traditional Illuminati symbol, and this one seems to be subdivided in triangles of colors that match some of the members of that group (for example, the blue part with a white circle and a number inside that identifies Reed Richards, or the gold and red from Ironman). I may be just reading too much into it.
– Alvaro Montoro
May 22 '18 at 21:24
|
show 1 more comment
I know this question is a bit of a stretch of what's on-topic and not, any suggestion for improving it will be welcomed.
– Alvaro Montoro
May 22 '18 at 15:08
3
Welcome to SFF! This seems perfectly on topic to me, nice spot!
– TheLethalCarrot
May 22 '18 at 15:10
3
Only suggestion I might add is to maybe include an image of the Avengers Illuminati symbol you're referencing for comparison.
– Mwr247
May 22 '18 at 16:33
possibly....cinemablend.com/news/1575759/…
– NKCampbell
May 22 '18 at 17:25
I don’t know if the Avengers Illuminati have a symbol. There’s the avengers sign inside an omega, but there’s no reference to it in the comic books I’ve read (Road to Civil War and New Avengers Illuminati). What I meant is that the Eye of Providence (a triangle with an eye inside) is a traditional Illuminati symbol, and this one seems to be subdivided in triangles of colors that match some of the members of that group (for example, the blue part with a white circle and a number inside that identifies Reed Richards, or the gold and red from Ironman). I may be just reading too much into it.
– Alvaro Montoro
May 22 '18 at 21:24
I know this question is a bit of a stretch of what's on-topic and not, any suggestion for improving it will be welcomed.
– Alvaro Montoro
May 22 '18 at 15:08
I know this question is a bit of a stretch of what's on-topic and not, any suggestion for improving it will be welcomed.
– Alvaro Montoro
May 22 '18 at 15:08
3
3
Welcome to SFF! This seems perfectly on topic to me, nice spot!
– TheLethalCarrot
May 22 '18 at 15:10
Welcome to SFF! This seems perfectly on topic to me, nice spot!
– TheLethalCarrot
May 22 '18 at 15:10
3
3
Only suggestion I might add is to maybe include an image of the Avengers Illuminati symbol you're referencing for comparison.
– Mwr247
May 22 '18 at 16:33
Only suggestion I might add is to maybe include an image of the Avengers Illuminati symbol you're referencing for comparison.
– Mwr247
May 22 '18 at 16:33
possibly....cinemablend.com/news/1575759/…
– NKCampbell
May 22 '18 at 17:25
possibly....cinemablend.com/news/1575759/…
– NKCampbell
May 22 '18 at 17:25
I don’t know if the Avengers Illuminati have a symbol. There’s the avengers sign inside an omega, but there’s no reference to it in the comic books I’ve read (Road to Civil War and New Avengers Illuminati). What I meant is that the Eye of Providence (a triangle with an eye inside) is a traditional Illuminati symbol, and this one seems to be subdivided in triangles of colors that match some of the members of that group (for example, the blue part with a white circle and a number inside that identifies Reed Richards, or the gold and red from Ironman). I may be just reading too much into it.
– Alvaro Montoro
May 22 '18 at 21:24
I don’t know if the Avengers Illuminati have a symbol. There’s the avengers sign inside an omega, but there’s no reference to it in the comic books I’ve read (Road to Civil War and New Avengers Illuminati). What I meant is that the Eye of Providence (a triangle with an eye inside) is a traditional Illuminati symbol, and this one seems to be subdivided in triangles of colors that match some of the members of that group (for example, the blue part with a white circle and a number inside that identifies Reed Richards, or the gold and red from Ironman). I may be just reading too much into it.
– Alvaro Montoro
May 22 '18 at 21:24
|
show 1 more comment
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
No official statement or comment has been released regarding this sticker. Thus, we cannot confirm or infirm that this sticker is actually related to the Illuminatis. However, I believe there is a set of striking coincidences which point towards this sticker actually being a subtle reference :
- The colors perfectly match Iron Man and Captain America's color scheme (although simplified)
- The Ultron project is a global surveillance and counter-terrorism program which is intended to directly confront threats like Hydra, which is an Illuminati-like organization by itself
- Ulysses Klaue's file references the Bilderberg meetings, which conspiracy theorists believe is an Illuminati get-together.
Let's review these points in order.
1. The bottom part of the triangle is red and gold, Iron Man's classic color scheme. This could reference the Iron Legion's status as the "working men" of the Avengers, expendable units built solely as the Avengers' grunts and workforce. They perform non-combat tasks like warding off citizens. On the other hand, the leading man of the group is Captain America : he's the military strategist and moral beacon who ensures the cohesion of the team, and its ruthless efficiency on the field.
Tony Stark (aka Iron Man) is a founding member of the comics' Illuminatis, who represent superhuman communites (the Fantastic Four, Atlantis, the X-Men, mystics, the Inhumans, and the Avengers). The purpose was to share valuable intel about internal and external threats in order to protect Earth efficiently. Most notably, each member of the Illuminatis believe they are qualified to protect Earth in secret. As Black Panther tells them before rejecting their adhesion offer :
You just decided all by yourselves that you are the Earth's protectors. And that you, and only you, not your teammates or family, are trustworthy enough to include in the process...
2. In Avengers : Age of Ultron, the titular supervillain is created when Tony's hubris convinces him he can program and unleash a superheroic AI. Intended to watch Earth through every mean available to detect threats and eliminate them (or send rescue efforts in case of a natural disaster), it was in essence a benevolent version of Hydra's own surveillance plan. In real life, most of the Illuminatis' mythos revolve around their supposed quasi-omniscient surveillance skills, used to control and cull whole populations. Why ? Because they believe they are better than the common folk. Ultron's concept is (theoretically speaking) an Illuminati's wet dream.
3. The Bilderberg meetings are secretive get-togethers in the eponymous Hotel de Bilderberg, in the Netherlands. These meetings are real, and were first creating to strengthen bonds between European and North American leaders. As the meetings' content has never been made public, conspiracy theorists believe the Bilderberg group is akin to the Illuminatis, or ARE the Illuminatis.
In Ulysses Klaue's SHIELD file, we can read the following description :
Ulysses Klaue was an assassin hired to take down T'Chaka at the Bilderberg conference in the case that he refused to negotiate Wakanda's resources including Vibranium. But, Klaue was also there personally, as the Panther killed his great-grandfather in the 19th century while this one was trying to annex Wakanda. He was paid ten million dollars for the kill.
Put together, these thematic elements may point to the Illuminati sticker being a multi-layered reference. I would say its actual significance hinges on whether you consider the Bilderberg meetings to be Illuminati reunions or not. And, of course, it is highly unlikely any member of the cast of production team will ever confirm or infirm this, especially if they do intend to create their own version the Illuminatis later on.
New contributor
Caelistis is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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No official statement or comment has been released regarding this sticker. Thus, we cannot confirm or infirm that this sticker is actually related to the Illuminatis. However, I believe there is a set of striking coincidences which point towards this sticker actually being a subtle reference :
- The colors perfectly match Iron Man and Captain America's color scheme (although simplified)
- The Ultron project is a global surveillance and counter-terrorism program which is intended to directly confront threats like Hydra, which is an Illuminati-like organization by itself
- Ulysses Klaue's file references the Bilderberg meetings, which conspiracy theorists believe is an Illuminati get-together.
Let's review these points in order.
1. The bottom part of the triangle is red and gold, Iron Man's classic color scheme. This could reference the Iron Legion's status as the "working men" of the Avengers, expendable units built solely as the Avengers' grunts and workforce. They perform non-combat tasks like warding off citizens. On the other hand, the leading man of the group is Captain America : he's the military strategist and moral beacon who ensures the cohesion of the team, and its ruthless efficiency on the field.
Tony Stark (aka Iron Man) is a founding member of the comics' Illuminatis, who represent superhuman communites (the Fantastic Four, Atlantis, the X-Men, mystics, the Inhumans, and the Avengers). The purpose was to share valuable intel about internal and external threats in order to protect Earth efficiently. Most notably, each member of the Illuminatis believe they are qualified to protect Earth in secret. As Black Panther tells them before rejecting their adhesion offer :
You just decided all by yourselves that you are the Earth's protectors. And that you, and only you, not your teammates or family, are trustworthy enough to include in the process...
2. In Avengers : Age of Ultron, the titular supervillain is created when Tony's hubris convinces him he can program and unleash a superheroic AI. Intended to watch Earth through every mean available to detect threats and eliminate them (or send rescue efforts in case of a natural disaster), it was in essence a benevolent version of Hydra's own surveillance plan. In real life, most of the Illuminatis' mythos revolve around their supposed quasi-omniscient surveillance skills, used to control and cull whole populations. Why ? Because they believe they are better than the common folk. Ultron's concept is (theoretically speaking) an Illuminati's wet dream.
3. The Bilderberg meetings are secretive get-togethers in the eponymous Hotel de Bilderberg, in the Netherlands. These meetings are real, and were first creating to strengthen bonds between European and North American leaders. As the meetings' content has never been made public, conspiracy theorists believe the Bilderberg group is akin to the Illuminatis, or ARE the Illuminatis.
In Ulysses Klaue's SHIELD file, we can read the following description :
Ulysses Klaue was an assassin hired to take down T'Chaka at the Bilderberg conference in the case that he refused to negotiate Wakanda's resources including Vibranium. But, Klaue was also there personally, as the Panther killed his great-grandfather in the 19th century while this one was trying to annex Wakanda. He was paid ten million dollars for the kill.
Put together, these thematic elements may point to the Illuminati sticker being a multi-layered reference. I would say its actual significance hinges on whether you consider the Bilderberg meetings to be Illuminati reunions or not. And, of course, it is highly unlikely any member of the cast of production team will ever confirm or infirm this, especially if they do intend to create their own version the Illuminatis later on.
New contributor
Caelistis is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
add a comment |
No official statement or comment has been released regarding this sticker. Thus, we cannot confirm or infirm that this sticker is actually related to the Illuminatis. However, I believe there is a set of striking coincidences which point towards this sticker actually being a subtle reference :
- The colors perfectly match Iron Man and Captain America's color scheme (although simplified)
- The Ultron project is a global surveillance and counter-terrorism program which is intended to directly confront threats like Hydra, which is an Illuminati-like organization by itself
- Ulysses Klaue's file references the Bilderberg meetings, which conspiracy theorists believe is an Illuminati get-together.
Let's review these points in order.
1. The bottom part of the triangle is red and gold, Iron Man's classic color scheme. This could reference the Iron Legion's status as the "working men" of the Avengers, expendable units built solely as the Avengers' grunts and workforce. They perform non-combat tasks like warding off citizens. On the other hand, the leading man of the group is Captain America : he's the military strategist and moral beacon who ensures the cohesion of the team, and its ruthless efficiency on the field.
Tony Stark (aka Iron Man) is a founding member of the comics' Illuminatis, who represent superhuman communites (the Fantastic Four, Atlantis, the X-Men, mystics, the Inhumans, and the Avengers). The purpose was to share valuable intel about internal and external threats in order to protect Earth efficiently. Most notably, each member of the Illuminatis believe they are qualified to protect Earth in secret. As Black Panther tells them before rejecting their adhesion offer :
You just decided all by yourselves that you are the Earth's protectors. And that you, and only you, not your teammates or family, are trustworthy enough to include in the process...
2. In Avengers : Age of Ultron, the titular supervillain is created when Tony's hubris convinces him he can program and unleash a superheroic AI. Intended to watch Earth through every mean available to detect threats and eliminate them (or send rescue efforts in case of a natural disaster), it was in essence a benevolent version of Hydra's own surveillance plan. In real life, most of the Illuminatis' mythos revolve around their supposed quasi-omniscient surveillance skills, used to control and cull whole populations. Why ? Because they believe they are better than the common folk. Ultron's concept is (theoretically speaking) an Illuminati's wet dream.
3. The Bilderberg meetings are secretive get-togethers in the eponymous Hotel de Bilderberg, in the Netherlands. These meetings are real, and were first creating to strengthen bonds between European and North American leaders. As the meetings' content has never been made public, conspiracy theorists believe the Bilderberg group is akin to the Illuminatis, or ARE the Illuminatis.
In Ulysses Klaue's SHIELD file, we can read the following description :
Ulysses Klaue was an assassin hired to take down T'Chaka at the Bilderberg conference in the case that he refused to negotiate Wakanda's resources including Vibranium. But, Klaue was also there personally, as the Panther killed his great-grandfather in the 19th century while this one was trying to annex Wakanda. He was paid ten million dollars for the kill.
Put together, these thematic elements may point to the Illuminati sticker being a multi-layered reference. I would say its actual significance hinges on whether you consider the Bilderberg meetings to be Illuminati reunions or not. And, of course, it is highly unlikely any member of the cast of production team will ever confirm or infirm this, especially if they do intend to create their own version the Illuminatis later on.
New contributor
Caelistis is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
add a comment |
No official statement or comment has been released regarding this sticker. Thus, we cannot confirm or infirm that this sticker is actually related to the Illuminatis. However, I believe there is a set of striking coincidences which point towards this sticker actually being a subtle reference :
- The colors perfectly match Iron Man and Captain America's color scheme (although simplified)
- The Ultron project is a global surveillance and counter-terrorism program which is intended to directly confront threats like Hydra, which is an Illuminati-like organization by itself
- Ulysses Klaue's file references the Bilderberg meetings, which conspiracy theorists believe is an Illuminati get-together.
Let's review these points in order.
1. The bottom part of the triangle is red and gold, Iron Man's classic color scheme. This could reference the Iron Legion's status as the "working men" of the Avengers, expendable units built solely as the Avengers' grunts and workforce. They perform non-combat tasks like warding off citizens. On the other hand, the leading man of the group is Captain America : he's the military strategist and moral beacon who ensures the cohesion of the team, and its ruthless efficiency on the field.
Tony Stark (aka Iron Man) is a founding member of the comics' Illuminatis, who represent superhuman communites (the Fantastic Four, Atlantis, the X-Men, mystics, the Inhumans, and the Avengers). The purpose was to share valuable intel about internal and external threats in order to protect Earth efficiently. Most notably, each member of the Illuminatis believe they are qualified to protect Earth in secret. As Black Panther tells them before rejecting their adhesion offer :
You just decided all by yourselves that you are the Earth's protectors. And that you, and only you, not your teammates or family, are trustworthy enough to include in the process...
2. In Avengers : Age of Ultron, the titular supervillain is created when Tony's hubris convinces him he can program and unleash a superheroic AI. Intended to watch Earth through every mean available to detect threats and eliminate them (or send rescue efforts in case of a natural disaster), it was in essence a benevolent version of Hydra's own surveillance plan. In real life, most of the Illuminatis' mythos revolve around their supposed quasi-omniscient surveillance skills, used to control and cull whole populations. Why ? Because they believe they are better than the common folk. Ultron's concept is (theoretically speaking) an Illuminati's wet dream.
3. The Bilderberg meetings are secretive get-togethers in the eponymous Hotel de Bilderberg, in the Netherlands. These meetings are real, and were first creating to strengthen bonds between European and North American leaders. As the meetings' content has never been made public, conspiracy theorists believe the Bilderberg group is akin to the Illuminatis, or ARE the Illuminatis.
In Ulysses Klaue's SHIELD file, we can read the following description :
Ulysses Klaue was an assassin hired to take down T'Chaka at the Bilderberg conference in the case that he refused to negotiate Wakanda's resources including Vibranium. But, Klaue was also there personally, as the Panther killed his great-grandfather in the 19th century while this one was trying to annex Wakanda. He was paid ten million dollars for the kill.
Put together, these thematic elements may point to the Illuminati sticker being a multi-layered reference. I would say its actual significance hinges on whether you consider the Bilderberg meetings to be Illuminati reunions or not. And, of course, it is highly unlikely any member of the cast of production team will ever confirm or infirm this, especially if they do intend to create their own version the Illuminatis later on.
New contributor
Caelistis is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
No official statement or comment has been released regarding this sticker. Thus, we cannot confirm or infirm that this sticker is actually related to the Illuminatis. However, I believe there is a set of striking coincidences which point towards this sticker actually being a subtle reference :
- The colors perfectly match Iron Man and Captain America's color scheme (although simplified)
- The Ultron project is a global surveillance and counter-terrorism program which is intended to directly confront threats like Hydra, which is an Illuminati-like organization by itself
- Ulysses Klaue's file references the Bilderberg meetings, which conspiracy theorists believe is an Illuminati get-together.
Let's review these points in order.
1. The bottom part of the triangle is red and gold, Iron Man's classic color scheme. This could reference the Iron Legion's status as the "working men" of the Avengers, expendable units built solely as the Avengers' grunts and workforce. They perform non-combat tasks like warding off citizens. On the other hand, the leading man of the group is Captain America : he's the military strategist and moral beacon who ensures the cohesion of the team, and its ruthless efficiency on the field.
Tony Stark (aka Iron Man) is a founding member of the comics' Illuminatis, who represent superhuman communites (the Fantastic Four, Atlantis, the X-Men, mystics, the Inhumans, and the Avengers). The purpose was to share valuable intel about internal and external threats in order to protect Earth efficiently. Most notably, each member of the Illuminatis believe they are qualified to protect Earth in secret. As Black Panther tells them before rejecting their adhesion offer :
You just decided all by yourselves that you are the Earth's protectors. And that you, and only you, not your teammates or family, are trustworthy enough to include in the process...
2. In Avengers : Age of Ultron, the titular supervillain is created when Tony's hubris convinces him he can program and unleash a superheroic AI. Intended to watch Earth through every mean available to detect threats and eliminate them (or send rescue efforts in case of a natural disaster), it was in essence a benevolent version of Hydra's own surveillance plan. In real life, most of the Illuminatis' mythos revolve around their supposed quasi-omniscient surveillance skills, used to control and cull whole populations. Why ? Because they believe they are better than the common folk. Ultron's concept is (theoretically speaking) an Illuminati's wet dream.
3. The Bilderberg meetings are secretive get-togethers in the eponymous Hotel de Bilderberg, in the Netherlands. These meetings are real, and were first creating to strengthen bonds between European and North American leaders. As the meetings' content has never been made public, conspiracy theorists believe the Bilderberg group is akin to the Illuminatis, or ARE the Illuminatis.
In Ulysses Klaue's SHIELD file, we can read the following description :
Ulysses Klaue was an assassin hired to take down T'Chaka at the Bilderberg conference in the case that he refused to negotiate Wakanda's resources including Vibranium. But, Klaue was also there personally, as the Panther killed his great-grandfather in the 19th century while this one was trying to annex Wakanda. He was paid ten million dollars for the kill.
Put together, these thematic elements may point to the Illuminati sticker being a multi-layered reference. I would say its actual significance hinges on whether you consider the Bilderberg meetings to be Illuminati reunions or not. And, of course, it is highly unlikely any member of the cast of production team will ever confirm or infirm this, especially if they do intend to create their own version the Illuminatis later on.
New contributor
Caelistis is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
New contributor
Caelistis is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
answered 10 mins ago
CaelistisCaelistis
1113
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Check out our Code of Conduct.
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Check out our Code of Conduct.
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I know this question is a bit of a stretch of what's on-topic and not, any suggestion for improving it will be welcomed.
– Alvaro Montoro
May 22 '18 at 15:08
3
Welcome to SFF! This seems perfectly on topic to me, nice spot!
– TheLethalCarrot
May 22 '18 at 15:10
3
Only suggestion I might add is to maybe include an image of the Avengers Illuminati symbol you're referencing for comparison.
– Mwr247
May 22 '18 at 16:33
possibly....cinemablend.com/news/1575759/…
– NKCampbell
May 22 '18 at 17:25
I don’t know if the Avengers Illuminati have a symbol. There’s the avengers sign inside an omega, but there’s no reference to it in the comic books I’ve read (Road to Civil War and New Avengers Illuminati). What I meant is that the Eye of Providence (a triangle with an eye inside) is a traditional Illuminati symbol, and this one seems to be subdivided in triangles of colors that match some of the members of that group (for example, the blue part with a white circle and a number inside that identifies Reed Richards, or the gold and red from Ironman). I may be just reading too much into it.
– Alvaro Montoro
May 22 '18 at 21:24